Kabe,

Go to the apprentice corner and read the thread "Where to Buy Forge Burners" by Evan Cihak. You can see Karl Andersen's forge and the blower he has on his forge. This is a small Dayton Squirrel Cage Blower. His looks like the same model as mine. The one I have is listed as "146 CFM" and is more than adequate. My homemade vertical forge is 16 inches in diameter so you can see that this small blower is all you need. This Dayton Blower on eBay is approximately $50 - $65. (Or was when I bought mine.) That price is very reasonable.

I do not know anything about Hightemp Tools Forge but have not heard anything negative. I have dealt with them and have always had good service.

I know you are new to the ABS and the Forum but if you will dig there is a lot of information to be found. Just take the time and look. I hope this helps a little.

Anthony Griggs

I recommend you go with the blower from Blacksmith's Depot. I know some folks will disagree with with me, but stay away from "squirrel cage" blowers..... particularly the shade pole variety. They look like a good deal because of their lower cost, but here's the thing..... a shade pole blower is NOT designed or built to handle ANY amount of back pressure, which is always present in a forge burner application. As back pressure increases on a shade pole blower, it draws more voltage, and when the "tipping point" is reached, the blower will be spinning at full speed, and will not be pushing any air through it (as back pressure increases, airflow decreases). Usually within a couple minutes of this happening, the voltage draw is such that the motor windings burn out.

I went through about a 1/2 dozen "squirrel cage"/shade pole blowers on my welding forge before I got all that figured out. After purchasing the 164 CFM blower from Blacksmith's Depot, I've not had a moments problem in over a dozen years of running it.

Concerning the PID control on a forge...... I will simply say DON'T. I cannot count the number of phone calls and emails I have fielded from people asking for help when they setup a PID controlled forge, and can't get it to work as they expected.

The reason(s) why are fairly simple....but its often hard for folks to wrap their head around..... its not just the interior volume of the forge that heats and cools when the solenoid valve kicks on and off....its the entire mass of the forge. What that means is that there are going to be swings in the temp of a PID controlled forge. How much swing depends on the overall mass of the interior volume, the type and quantity of insulation, and even the body/shell makeup come into play.

What all that equates to is that the forge MIGHT hold within 50-100F either way from the set point... IF you are very lucky. (That's the closest tolerance I've ever heard anyone achieve.) Most (although you won't seen them admit it on any forum) see a temp swing of 250-500F either way from the set point. To go along with that, I truly believe that with a forge, "the more you over take the pluming, the easier it is to stop up the drain". Meaning that the more connections, whether its piping or electrical wiring, just means that many more things can, and often will go wrong.

Look at the type of forges that the "top" bladesmiths use...... they are very basic/simple designs, with only the minimum of parts necessary for the intended function. It's far less troublesome to simply learn to concentrate on whats happening inside the forge, and pull your work out when its ready.

The moral of the story is this...... you can take a bit of time to learn to concentrate on your forge, and what's going on inside, or you can spend A LOT of time chasing issues and trying to solve problems (IE: A PID controlled forge.) Based on my experiences of/with PID controlled forges, the latter is usually the case. The biggest rule of thumb that I always tell people when they ask me about building a forge is this....... K.I.S.S <img src=' http://www.americanbladesmith.com/ipboard/public/style_emoticons//smile.gi f' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />

Thank you Mr. Griggs, and Mr. Caffrey. I appreciate you both taking the time to respond to my questions. It amazes me how quickly a detailed, informative response was added to this thread in comparison to other forums I have been a member too.

After considering your advice, I am still planing on purchasing a PID and thermocouple so I can at least monitor the temperature. I know my choice in a forge is an expensive one, but I'm sure with the reputation Wayne has at HTT, I'm going to get my money's worth.

Thanks again guys. Can't wait to start hammering.

|quoted:

Thank you Mr. Griggs, and Mr. Caffrey. I appreciate you both taking the time to respond to my questions. It amazes me how quickly a detailed, informative response was added to this thread in comparison to other forums I have been a member too.

After considering your advice, I am still planing on purchasing a PID and thermocouple so I can at least monitor the temperature. I know my choice in a forge is an expensive one, but I'm sure with the reputation Wayne has at HTT, I'm going to get my money's worth.

Can anyone give their opinion on Uncle Al's vertical forge vs High Temp Tools?

Thanks again guys. Can't wait to start hammering.

I agree with the PID/thermocouple for a pyrometer. If you haven't seen it yet, here a link to building a pyrometer with a PID and thermocouple: http://www.caffreyknives.net/forge_pyrometer.html

Kabe,

I am relatively new to the ABS forum also. I hope I did not sound rude. With the experience of smiths like Ed Caffrey and a host of others and the willingness to help all of us with any questions we might have, that makes the ABS one of the most helpful and educational organizations.

Again, I hope I was able to help a little.

Uncle Al's forge is advertised at 16", I hope that is the diameter. To me if you have the room in your shop, larger is better. I know Uncle Al, he sets up an has supplies at the Hammer Inns. A lot of knife makers use his tools.

Anthony Griggs