Great topic. I LIKE WOOD!

I think as a starter; before we discuss finishing wood; how about we each list a few of the woods we like and why we like that particular one. And maybe even what we think of as some negatives for each one.

For me a wood on a knife must be:

1. Stable; doesn't move around, check or split.

2. Must work to the style and shape of the knife and fittings in grain, flow, and color. Not detract from the overall nor overwhelm it.

3. Finished well. Open pores, a wipe of shoe polish, and a shot of rattle can finish usually looks; well, less than finished.

My list of favorites:

1. Desert Ironwood. Hard, dense and requires nothing for finish but a wipe of wax. Good stuff is getting very hard to find and expensive. The usual muddy brown that we see is very common now on tables and doesn't do much for a knife.

2. Curly Maple. Runs from hard to real soft. Great figure to very poor. Economical to buy. To get a great finish is very time consuming in the scheme of things which adds greatly to the cost. I really like it when you get the thing finished and the chatoyance and figure just pops.

3. Bubinga. Not a lot out there on knives. Good figure is not common, but looks great when you find it. Finishes pretty well and is one of the most stable woods I have used.

4. Walnut. Pretty much like maple in a darker scheme. Very hard to mushy. Very plain to wow. Inexpensive. Takes valuable time to finish properly. I do prefer good walnut over most of the ironwood out there now.

5. African Blackwood. Hard, dense, black, requires no finishing time. Looks classy. Very elegant. Not cheap.

Those are my usual suspects. To finish each of them requires a very different process.

Mike

Good topic, guys. I buy most of my wood on line. I have a few sellers on ebay that I have been very happy with.

1)Koa is probably my favorite. Most is highly figured and not too hard. But never too soft. If the wood is not stabilized I will send it to get stabilized.

2)Desert Ironwood is up there on my list. always hard,( which to me is easier to work with) and even tempered. Doesn't have to be stabilized. Polishes up real nice.

3)Blackwood is a lot like ironwood but not as chippy. Also doesn't have to be stabilized. Takes a real nice shine with just wax and a good buff.

4)Almost anything burlwood. It's usually hard enough to be able to work well, but does have to be stabilized. then finishing is the same. Wax and a buff.

I buy all my wood on ebay and have never been mislead or deceived. this is their job. they want to sell more wood they will be honest and usually tell you the % of moisture. I try not to limit myself to only just a few types of woods because I find what I'm looking for in other types of wood. So I really do hand pick all of my wood.

Jim

Sorry about that Steve, I didn't finish the guts of my topic.

I gave you some of my favorite woods to use, but there are always more out there. I will list my favorite suppliers but I did want to mention I'm not shy from buying large blocks of woods and cutting them up myself then sending them out to be stabilized.

For stabilizing wood I use K&G or Mike with Woodlab.biz. Both are very good and know their business.

1) For wood suppliers as I said,m I use ebay & never been burned.

a)exoticwoods - all different kinds of stabilized woods.

b)staburl- very nice stabilized woods.

c)islewoods- for lots of Koa. I think he may be the largest seller of Koa wood. Koa is only found in Hawaii and if I'm not mistaken only 2 of the 8 islands have it. Also, it can only be taken when the tree is dead, dyeing, or has fallen.

d)Bell Forest- which does not stabilized, but most of their wood is at 6% which is where those that stabilize want the wood.

There are more out there but these are the ones I use and have been very satisfied with.

As far as shaping my handles I usually start out with wood files to rough it out, then switch to sandpaper from 80-120. And go up from there. If I have a piece of wood that is stabilized I will go as high as 1500 with my paper then just wax and buff. If I feel the wood will need more than wax and a buff I will bring it up to about 600 grit then I will start with tru-oil.

Lay down 1st. coat of tru-oil (thin coat) and let it dry for about 4-6 hrs.

Then I will sand it with 00 steel wool, then wipe w/ a tack rag.

I will do this for about 4 coats going up to 0000 steel wool. Always wipe afterwards w/ a tack rag.

I will follow up with using rottenstone and tru-oil for a few coats w/ just buffing it lightly between coats. That is how I find to get the nicest shine w/ a very deep look w/ lots of that big word that Mike used. Chatoyance??? Ya that's it.

Jim

My all around standard wood for a working knife handle would have to be Cocobolo. This central/south American hardwood has great grain, finishes with little or no additives and requires no stabilization. The natural waxy nature of this wood gums up your sandpaper pretty quickly, but for a working knife it's an obvious choice. My personal hunter has a Cocobolo handle on it and it hasn't shrunk, cracked, or checked in 7 years of pretty hard use and it still looks great. Cocobolo is available at most woodworker supply shops. I get mine from Woodworker's source here in Phoenix. I buy the 8/4 board stock and cut my own blanks.

Next up is any stabilized burl wood. I have bought both scales and blocks from a variety of suppliers in a variety of species. The Black Ash, Box Elder, and California Buckeye are my favorites. These can be viewed here: http://www.dosgatosdesignsllc.com/#!sharp-stuff

The Persian Fighter has the Buckeye, the Mokume Bowie has the Black Ash, and the Chef's knife has the Box Elder. Stabilized woods can be tricky to buy because the stabilization process may or may not be complete depending on who did the work. Most of the slabs I've purchased were OK, but some were not completely saturated through. The same goes for the blocks. So far the most dependable stabilizer I have found is here in Arizona at K&G Finishing Supplies. http://www.knifeandgun.com/

Stabilized wood also gums up your paper and files pretty quickly, so be prepared to clean the tools often and throw a lot of paper away. Depending on what the stabilization medium is, it can buff out to a polish with as little as 320 grit finish. No need to sand any finer as the buffing wheel will smooth it out and shine it up like no tomorrow.

If you buy stabilized wood, test it by dropping it into a bucket of water. If it sinks, it's probably good all the way through. If it floats, or absorbs any moisture, send it back or resign yourself to finishing the stabilization process yourself. I have tried a variety of stabilization mediums on a couple of species of wood in my shop. More on that later, as I am setting up to try stabilizing a piece of leopard wood using automotive clear coat. Hope to have some photos of the process and product to post here in a week or two. Home stabilizing is messy, and difficult to achieve so I don't recommend it unless you happen to be as curious as I am about how stuff works. Several companies out there (including K&G) will stabilized your handle product for a small fee.

I am a fairly new knifemaker and have tried to use a variety of handle materials. I have used natural (non-stabilized) woods like ironwood, cocobolo, mesquite and bubinga. The bubinga was the most difficult as I like to use the grinder to do my initial rough shaping and any pressure at all would burn the wood. It is extremely dense and even hand sanding can be a chore. The cocobolo and mesquite were easy to shape, sand and finish. I buffed the ironwood and cocobolo after 1500 grit sanding. I used CA to seal the mesquite a few times, sanded between each coat and then lightly buffed.

For stabilized wood I have used curly and lace redwood, maple burl, claro-walnut burl, boxed elder burl, cherry burl, spalted water oak and cottonwood burl. I have used true oil to finish a few of the spalted water oak handles and it really brought out the spalted grain pattern. The others I took to 1500 grit and buffed with either white or jewelers compound. I have been sending my blanks to K&G for stabilizing and typically cut my own wood from suppliers on Ebay or Woodcrafters.

I hope that some of you will post your methods to stain and finish your handles. I am sure that there are a lot of different techniques here.

|quoted:

3. Bubinga. Not a lot out there on knives. Good figure is not common, but looks great when you find it. Finishes pretty well and is one of the most stable woods I have used.

Mike

Agreed!

This is a prior post by Master Smith Jack Fuller about curly maple handle material with a story about ABS founder Bill Moran.

Bill Moran and I in about 1980 went to visit Wayne Dunlap in Chantilly, Virginia to purchase some curly maple for handle material. Bill Moran discovered Wayne Dunlap through black powder rifles. Wayne had a warehouse full of beautiful curly maple and was selling some of the wood "scraps" at that time for firewood. He was in the business of cutting gun stock blanks out of curly maple to sell to custom gun makers. That day I had my Blazer and Bill and I loaded it full with what Wayne was calling "scraps" at the time but were highly figured curly maple which made great knife handles. Wayne no longer sells scraps but it is still a great place to find curly maple.

Today I make my knife handles with curly maple or sambar stag. I also use some ivory and giraffe bone for my handles.

I stain my curly maple with Fiebings Professional Oil Leather Stain. I finish the handles with a home made mixture made by Keith Casteel who is a well known custom gun maker known for his outstanding engraving. Keith sells the "Woodstock Oil Finish" for $5 a bottle and it works quite well to produce a very nice finish.

This is the contact information for Keith Casteel:

Keith Casteel

Rt.1, Box 38

Bruceton Mills, West Virgina 26525

304-379-8309

[email protected]

A few years ago Jack Fuller took me to meet Wayne Dunlap in Chantilly, VA and I have been obtaining my supply of high quality curly maple from Wayne ever since.

I don't like working with stabilized woods.. might just be my bend to historical designs.. I tend to just design my handles so that they can move.

My go to is curly maple I just love that wood. My second is Bubinga great wood with nice color. I have also been having a good experiences with some verities of Mahogany. Walnut is good but needs to have good grain to be worth the effort of finishing, and fruit woods like apple, cherry, peach etc can also be good. For axes I like hickory or Ash and of course Maple.

I have stopped working with just about all other exotic/non native hard woods, cocabola Winge purpleheart, most rosewoods etc as I have become Very sensitive to the dust, I mistook a piece of Winge for something else in anothers shop last month and STILL have a rash from it ... I hate Winge...

MP

If a knife handle material CAN be stabilized - I want it stabilized.

I often keep a small collection of even stabilized curly maple. Stabilizing adds to the beauty as well as the workability of most woods.

Burls are about worthless without being stabilized.

When it comes to stabilized woods - I really try to have my own stock. I seek out my materials from all directions, cut them up, make sure they're dry, and send them to KnG for processing.

I'm pretty picky about buying stabilized material. Normally, I want to see it in person. Almost like buying stag.

If I order it on line, I pretty much only order from 2-3 suppliers that I know will take it back, and use KnG for the processing.

I find there is a HUGE!! markup by the suppliers.

Even after you include shipping, processing only costs about 7 bucks per block.

And it's not rare to find $70.00 handle material these days. Even pushing 50 bucks - I feel - is taking things a bit too far.

So, I tend to seek out my own materials.

I love Bubinga. Even the low-grade figure is acceptable.

I've pretty much given up on Ironwood. Yes - it is pretty. But the last two pieces I use by a reputable dealer both had voids in them in which I cold have hidden a spare house key. <img src=' http://www.americanbladesmith.com/ipboard/public/style_emoticons//ohmy.gi f' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':o' />

And at $60.00+ - it was quite a loss. He was reluctant to give me a refund saying I should know how to fix them.

So - I've quit using it.

I peruse the dealers and pick up the ones that jump out at me.

After finishing, I almost always give 1-2 coats of pure tung oil. It really improves the character.

Lots of great information here.

I'm with Karl in that it is almost always better to pick out your handle material first hand. We've probably all been burnt by buying remotely.

My choices of woods are pretty much the same as what has been mentioned with blackwood and crotch walnut topping the list. I have always preferred woods that require no staining and find that the dark colored woods sell best. With the exception of blackwood, I usually find that the more highly figured & unique the wood is, the better.

There is a huge difference in the stability of woods (propensity to chance in size due to changes in moisture content). I try to avoid using those that tend to be more unstable (unless professionally stabilized). If you want an excellent book on the qualities of different woods get a copy of "Understanding Wood" by R. Bruce Hoadley. He is to wood what Verhoeven is to steel.

The blackwood does not need any finish due to all of the natural waxes in it. For the walnut I use a combination of boiled linseed oil & urethane that I get from Brownell's called "Pro Oil". (I feel like the combination of finishes is more durable than just the linseed oil by itself but just as easy to apply) I usually apply 8-10 coats.

For an adhesive I use AcraGlas almost exclusively. It is by far the toughest of the epoxies and the only one that I know of that won't degrade for 100 years. [Many epoxies will start to degrade after 8-10 years.] There will occasionally be times when you need an instant bond where super glue is indispensable. The thin and gap filling versions are always in my shop. [Even though theses are excellent adhesives it is normally wise to have a mechanical bond as well as a chemical one.]

Gary

Types of wood: My favorite is African Blackwood. It lends all of the characteristics I like.....fine grained, easy to work and carve/texture, needs no finish, and best of all, it does not check and crack over time like Ebony does. I keep a huge cabinet full of wood in the shop, spanning many varieties.

Suppliers: This is where I have a problem, and a bone to pick. I've been at this for a long time, and have watched as more and more folks get into selling "knife handle" woods. I'm disgusted almost every time I go to a show or look on the web at wood handle materials. The reason? Prices. When I see a handle sized block of maple, with a price tag of $60+, it's just stupid! I understand that the prices of things increase over the years, but most of these folks selling handle materials are doing nothing more then gouging. OK, I won't go off anymore, but suffice to say that because of the price gouging on handle materials, I will usually purchase mine in larger pieces, then cut and process it myself. I tried for a few years to stabilize my own woods, but found that unless you're using the commercial stabilizing agents, your just spinning your wheels. If I need stabiliing, things get sent out.

Tools: Each type of wood requires a different approach to working and finishing. Some woods, such as Koa, will burn easily when grinding, and extreme care must be taken when working it. Personally, I feel that nothing will give a knife more value then hand finishing, which includes handles. With that approach in mind, I will rough out handles with a 50 grit belt, then jump to a 220 to refine it, and then use a 400 to clean up the 220 scratches. From there I generally finish out by hand with 400, 600, and depend on the specific wood, may go as high as 1200.

Finishing: The majority of the wood handles I produce do not get any type of liquid finish....generally just a light buff, and a good coat of wax. I can't count the number of emails and phone calls I've fielded over the years when someone tried to "finish" Ironwood, Blackwood, or Cocobolo with urethane or some other liquid finish. I know those were all because of inexperience, but for anyone thinking of doing that....just DON'T. <img src=' http://www.americanbladesmith.com/ipboard/public/style_emoticons//smile.gi f' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' /> For non-stabilized woods (that need it), I use Tru-Oil. It's a time consuming process, but when correctly applied, and taken to 10+ coats, it really intensifies the wood's beauty, and it very durable.

"Glues": I produce a lot of hidden tang knives, many of which depend souly on the "glue". During my early years of knifemaking, and not knowing any better, I used Devcon 5min epoxy. About 5 years into my knifemaking, I started getting calls from folks who had purchased early knives from me, with the complaint that the handles were coming loose! That started me on a long road of researching adhesives. Long story short.....after getting a chemical engineer from one of the major companies to open up, I found that nearly all of the two part epoxies on the market are chemically engineered to start breaking down at the 5-7 year point. (Yeah, it blew my mind too) But as the engineer explained it to me....."My job depends on people buying epoxy....I'm not going to develop a glue that lasts forever...or I'd quickly be out of a job!" I guess if you look at from that perspective.......

Personally, the only "glue" that I will use on knives is AccraGlass from Brownells. It has a shelf life of 10 years, and a hold life of 50 years. Next in line would be the West Systems, with a slightly shorter shelf and hold life. Some folks are put off when they see the price of AccraGlass, but the "shop kit" is actually a lot cheaper then buying the little two tube syringe of Devcon at the hardware stores.

I don't have near the volumes of experience most that have posted do, but am glad to see I generally do things the same. I recently used ironwood for the first time and quickly found out it's like Blackwood and Cocobolo-don't oil it... Take the grits up and then buff with pink no scratch and it leaves a great finish. For other hardwoods, I generally sand with Danish oil once I get to 400 or better. It makes a slurry and fills in the pores, making the end product really smooth. Then, I'll finish off with very light coats of tru oil like Ed mentioned.

A very important note..... Do NOT put on any other oil/proceed with the process until the last coat is totally dry. I once made that mistake and "hurried" things along. It looked pretty good, so I applied the next coat of tru oil. When you do that, the coat underneath never dries. The finish gets splotchy and there are shiny and dull spots. And the only way to fix it is sand back down and start all over again...

A few problems I've run into, especially when I was first starting out:

Some woods have more of a tendency to tear out, others are brittle. I really liked the look of some Lacewood I saw and figured it would make a great knife handle. I quickly learned that aggressive files/rasps didn't agree with the wood very well. I'm guessing that because of the "cells" of the wood, when a piece got caught in the teeth of a rasp, it wanted to tear out. Somewhat the same as working various pieces of Palm wood. They can make neat looking handles, but they're more effort to get looking nice. Just take it a bit slower and use less aggressive cut files or other tools as you go.

Also, I had problems with lighter woods during finishing. Another of those new guy moments was seeing the metal dust from the guard ending up on/in the wood next to it. I'm guessing some makers have great tricks on how to deal with this. For me, I just ended up being really careful with which direction I sand at those final grits.

Tools for working the handle material:

I have a variable speed 2x72 and get all kinds of nervous when working on the handles with it. Part of it is my lack of technique, I'm sure. But something about totally messing the handle up with gouges or something after all the time in....well, it just makes me nervous. I'll use it to rough things out and do use my contact wheel to help me sculpt the scales on a full tang. But, then I'm off to hand work only from there. The last hidden tang knives I did got generally profiled on the grinder and then completely worked down with a four way file/rasp and coping saw where needed. You can make a significant amount of progress in a relatively short amount of time. I like to keep looking at things as I go and it's easy not to make a big mistake this way. I'll use whatever files I have to help take out the roughest marks then move to my Rhinowet sandpaper with various backing sticks.

Jeremy

|quoted:

I have a variable speed 2x72 and get all kinds of nervous when working on the handles with it.

Jeremy

And it is for that very reason that many times, my knife handles don't even get to the same end of the room as my grinders.

Other times, I will attach my 2" small wheel and a dedicated 36 grit belt. That's the only belt I use on knife handles, and I am only on my second one since 2007. That's all the $$ I've invested in belts for knife handles in 7 years.

I'll just slow the belt down, gently knock the corners off and then never go near a belt again.

I finish shaping with high end cabinet maker's rasps and files.

No mistakes.

Never get in trouble.

Never burn the handle material, etc.

Jeremy and all,

The only time I work a solid wood handle on my belt grinder is when the knife meets these two criteria:

1. It is a partial/stub tang with a solid block handle and I am grinding the handle, spacer, and guard simultaneously.

2. I am using the slack belt at very low speed.

Most of my handles are frame handles and I finish them off of the knife with the spacers attached. I will use the 2x72 to do the profiles only and then I will use the 9 inch disk (variable speed and reversible)to do most of the heavy lifting on the sides, i.e. from 60 grit to 150, and maybe a little at 220 (also at pretty low speed). By the time I have finished the 150 grit the handle is pretty much the exact shape I desire, so from there it's hand sanding with a sponge or just my fingers. Natural woods generally get hand sanded to around 600 grit before buffing with a white rouge and cleaned with a mild solvent. Then it's either a bowling alley wax buff on a sewn wheel or 3-coats of Danish oil. I have substituted the citrus/orange oil-wax once or twice. I think it tends to penetrate the pores of the wood better than other waxes.

A quick word on waxes or oil finishes and something I learned from my past life as a wood worker: put the oil or wax on fairly soon after you have finished sanding for maximum penetration. If you have to leave the wood hanging out over night or a few days before applying the first coat, take a really fine sand paper (800 or better) and lightly go over it again.