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Problem With Glue On Hidden Tang

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cal harkins
Posts: 69
Member
Topic starter
 

I have always used Devcon 2 ton epoxy for gluing scales on hidden tang knives. I helped my friend put a hidden tang blade together with a piece of elk antler and a stainless butt cap. We noticed after a few days that something was leaking out from around the spacer. It was the glue. We took the knife apart. The front part of the glue was kind of soft and the back part of the glue was kind of rubbery. Does anyone have any idea what the problem is? We tried to mix the glue 50:50 as close as we could. I have always stored the glue in the refrigerator. I don't know, bad batch of glue, glue too old, glue got to hot in shipping??

Thanks for your ideas.

 
Posted : 22/12/2015 9:12 pm
Karl B. Andersen
Posts: 1067
Member
 

This is simply the result of using off-the-shelf epoxies.

Mixing is always questionable and shelf life can be a problem, as well.

One of the things I had to come to terms with rather early in my knife making career was that if I was going to make a knife that I wanted to last forever, I had best invest in epoxy that is of high quality.

I have not used hardware store adhesives since, and all of my problems disappeared, too.

Two quality glues come to mind - West System and Acra-glas.

Look at it this way - marine epoxy is meant to hold boats together under all types of environmental conditions with all types of solvents and cleaners on board.

Acra-glas is a bedding cement used in firearms to assist in proper barrel alignment - forever.

There is a huge difference in these two types of epoxies, and the "homeowner" stuff that is just designed to stick a couple things together to get you by.

I use the West System, and one thing I like about it is that until the epoxy sets up 100%, and residue can be cleaned up with denatured alcohol.

The choice is yours.

Karl B. Andersen

Journeyman Smith

 
Posted : 22/12/2015 10:27 pm
Joshua States
Posts: 1157
Member
 

Whatever epoxy you use, and Karl has suggested what industry standards are often considered the "best", leave your mixing palette and spatula on the workbench. Check the mixing palette at the time that the epoxy says is "set-up" time. If the stuff on the palette isn't set and stiff, the mixture wasn't right, or the epoxy has gone bad. Disassemble, clean the parts, and try again.

Joshua States

www.dosgatosforge.com

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg

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Also on Instagram and Facebook as J.States Bladesmith

“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.”

 
Posted : 23/12/2015 12:56 am
Lin Rhea
Posts: 1563
Member
 

I could not add much to what Karl and Joshua have already said. I use West Systems or

Acra-Glass. Either one. I also do as Joshua does. I mix mine in the little fast food ketchup cups with a popsicle stick and check it's progress as it cures.

Lin Rhea, ABS Mastersmith

[email="[email protected]"]Email me[/email]

www.rheaknives.com

 
Posted : 23/12/2015 9:59 am
cal harkins
Posts: 69
Member
Topic starter
 

I appreciate everyone's input. I will be changing to a better epoxy. It will either be acra-glass or West Systems. Can anyone tell me about storage conditoins and shelf life of these epoxies?

Thanks again for your replies.

 
Posted : 23/12/2015 10:27 am
Posts: 307
Member
 

Yup-totally agree with what has been said. I use Acraglas that I got from Brownells. I can't remember off hand, but I believe it has a pretty significant shelf life. That was one reason I went with it, since I don't make a whole lot of knives. And the suggestion to leave the mixing cup and stick on the bench is a REALLY good one. Being able to see that it set up properly is definitely some peace of mind.

One other benefit you'll get from these better epoxies is the work time. In general, the longer it takes to set up, the longer the work time you've got before it starts getting all gooey and gels up. I hope I'm not the only one who has run into a whoops moment during glue up....but with a better epoxy that's already been mixed, you can quickly take care of the issue at hand and still work with the epoxy.

Jeremy

Jeremy Lindley, Apprentice Smith

 
Posted : 23/12/2015 11:54 am
Posts: 0
New Member Guest
 

I've settled on Devcon two ton epoxy after trying several. I've never had any issues after switching.

No matter what you use remember surface prep is all important. I also wipe down the surfaces with acetone.

One other tip is to cure it with heat if your handle material can handle it. I use a lot of micarta and G10. It goes in the toaster oven for an hour at 175 degrees. I wouldn't use heat on natural materials.

 
Posted : 04/03/2016 2:13 am
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