So today I severed my relationship with my propane supplier of over 15 years, they didn’t like it, but I got some satisfaction. After many years of dealing with the same local, mom and pop, LP gas supplier, about two years ago trouble started when they were bought out by a large gas supply corporation. Suddenly the friendly, non-formal, days of the guys delivering gas and stopping to watch me forge and shoot the breeze was replaced with added fees for not buying enough in a certain time period.
Then last fall I got a letter in the mail stating that I could get no more propane delivered to my 330 gallon tank until I allowed them access to the interior of my shop to do a proper line inspection. Naturally I was quite dubious about this request and so I proceeded quite cautiously. When they came and looked at my setup I was informed that since my gas forge and salt bath system was not UL listed (umm yeah, I built them myself) that I could no longer receive propane as long as they were hooked up to the gas lines and that the only regulator that was allowed was the one they had provided for my furnace. Since my tank was set by the original good guys it was now the property of the new non-caring corporation, and I was officially shutoff for LP deliveries.
All this winter I carted 100 lb. bottles back to my shop to get by and last week I notified the LP company that I wanted their tank, that they would no longer fill, off my property. Cautiously I asked and, sure enough, there were ready to charge me quite a hefty fee to remove their empty tank from my property. So let me sum this up, these jerks shut me off from any more refills of their tank from them, regardless of whether I had to make a living or not, and then were going to charge me for them coming onto my property to remove the tank they would no longer fill.
Today I pulled into their local office with their lousy tank on a trailer and told them to take it. I made the guy who unloaded it sign a receipt listing all of their property, from the tank and regulators down to the stinking copper line that fed my shop, as proof that I had delivered it to them (no charge).
Has anybody else experienced this sort of hassle from a LP supplier? I hope this is not a sign of things to come, but in the nanny state I fear it is.
"One test is worth 1000 'expert' opinions" Riehle Testing Machines Co.
I had similar issues, not to the same level though. My tank was for heating my house only. The amount they were charging was outrageous. I got so frustrated that I had them come get the tank, they didn't charge for it though. I now heat my house with wood as my only heat source. I still lug tanks for my forge.
Chris
we had a local suppler was also bought out ... we found another local place.. nothing as bad as you are describing. I do know in CT code has that line pressure can be no more than 12psi that can limit the usefulness of atmospheric forges. we have all ways run 100lb tanks, and had deliveries to fill them, (we currently have 4 tanks) that has worked well for us and we still get the lower cost of the delivery price.
I have had to get set up three times in the last maybe 7-8 years with a bulk tank. Each time I had to agree - by signature - to get at least two fills per year.
I have yet to witness any sort of enforcement of that regulation.
I've never been restricted regarding equipment like regulators.
I have willingly let them check the lines for leaks. I have insurance on my shop so I figured it might help to be able to say it was inspected by the gas company.
It might help that we also have more than one supplier in the community. When there's a monopoly they like to dictate!!!
Karl B. Andersen
Journeyman Smith
It's not the "nanny state" Kevin, it's the "lawyer's state" that drives this kind of thinking. As the LP supplier company, when they hook up their equipment, and supply propane to unlisted/unpermitted/non-code compliant systems, they become liable for any problems you might have down the road.
For those of you who do not already know, I am what would be considered a subject matter expert on residential building codes. So, here's what I suggest.
Find out if your local municipality will issue you a permit to install a gas piping system at your personal residence as the owner/plumber. Many states have rules that allow a property owner to do the work at their personal residence without hiring a licensed contractor. Some states limit the work an owner can do.
If your local municipality will let you do your own gas line work, send me a layout of your shop with the LP appliances you want to hook up. Provide me with all of the distances in feet between the tank location to the shop and in between the gas appliances inside the shop. I will draw you a gas line schematic, with pipe sizing (tell me what type of pipe you intend to use) and valve locations that will pass the requirements of the IRC (International Residential Code) and the IFGC (International Fuel Gas Code) that you can go get a permit with (providing those codes apply in your jurisdiction). Then you get the permit, install the piping, and get the local jurisdiction to pass the installation. That puts the responsibility back on you and the local jurisdiction and the LP company is off the hook.
I will do this for anyone on this forum that has trouble getting LP gas to their shop from the local LP supply company.
Joshua States
www.dosgatosforge.com
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Also on Instagram and Facebook as J.States Bladesmith
“So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin’ to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. I've been there before.â€
Omm question: Why don't you guy's just buy a tank instead of renting one. That way its your propain tank and your set up. Then you just need a as needed refill instead of paying rental fees on top of refilling fees and to be safe have the take inspected every five years or so for safety reasons. i know my welding instructor who also has a shop when this direction for his oxie-fuel and CO2 tanks. I use a small forge and a 20 pound tank at the moment but i own the 20 pound tank and it takes me only 20 minuets max to take the tank to the local gas station and get it refilled for 17 bucks. so I have not had to deal with filling or deliveries yet. Its also nice to use the small tank cause if i feel like it i can spend 23 bucks to swap it for a new a full 20 pound tank have it swapped out for a new one.
Analogy story: I view this like I did with sray painting my gundam models, I could have spent less on spray paint cans or shelled out 100 bucks for a airbrush starters kit that came with everything I needed excluding the paint, which was another or 20-30 bucks for a 5 primary colors set and some primer. I went with buying a airbrush because well it cost more at the beginning, it gave me far more creative freedom with how I painted my kits as i could take the 5 primary colors (well 5 primary colors plus green as green is hard to mix) and mix my own pigments, of it so i am not be stuck with the a paint that was almost right insted i have paints that are "this is the color i in visioned it when i planned to paint it. then i spent 5 bucks on a a small jar of gold ands silver paints as its hard to find the 5 primary in metallic colors.
I also like to paint these robot kits in at least three colors and for just a small can of good model spray paint costs 7-10 bucks so just buying 3 paints and a can of primer i would be out 40 bucks just for the three colors. if i wanted more of a different color i would have to shell out another 10 bucks. so what is better a investment of well lets call it 140 with tax on a airbrush starters set that includes 3 different airbrushes and paint that gives me a near limitless amount of color options when i can mix paint , or shelling out 40 bucks for just 4 cans of paint.
For me i would rather spend a bit more at start up to allow me to have less cost in the long run then spend more in interest and fees in the long run.
God i'm only 30, but I talk like I am 90 at times. However, my grandfather did a good job teaching me the difference between knowledge and wisdom.
