Tate,

Anytime a test applicant deviates much from the ABS "norm" he/she is taking on added responsibility. Make sure that your Japanese style knife is a good example of such a knife. The judges or at least some of them will be familiar with that style and know if it is "right" or not, fit and finish aside.

I would choose to make knives that the mainstream ABS would recognize for my test knives, but you can do what you want. I realize you are testing for JS, but here are some examples of test knives submitted by MS canidates. I notice at least one Japanese style knife in there. Lin

My link

Very nice presentation in your link Lin

Thank you

<img src=' http://www.americanbladesmiths.com/ipboard/public/style_emoticons//cool.gi f' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='B)' />

David, The link is on the Testing page and I cant take credit for it. I'm just pointing it out. I'm not sure why it says "My link". <img src=' http://www.americanbladesmiths.com/ipboard/public/style_emoticons//unsure.gi f' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':unsure:' />

When I was trying to decide what knives to make for my MS test, I looked for a while with very little results for examples of previous group shots of test knives. This seems to be a BIG question that arises as makers are contemplating the test. This feature of the ABS site is going to be a real help to those in the future.

Tate, if there is anything I can do just holler. Much success on your test. Lin <img src=' http://www.americanbladesmiths.com/ipboard/public/style_emoticons//smile.gi f' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />

Thank you Lin. I planned on making at least one "extra" knife just in case anything happens to one or if I decide there is a problem with one. Perhaps the japanese style one will be my extra, and if it turns out well enough, I may include it. Thank you for the kind offer.

When the time comes for the performance test, I'll have to travel, since there are no MS in my area. I live in the Minneapolis area of MN. Hopefully I can find someone relatively close, who would be willing to conduct the test. Since there is no one in the area to critique my work, I hope to have some of the test knives done at the time so I can get honest feedback from a MS.

Hello Tate and welcome. I would think that if you were to submit a japanese style blade, such as a traditional tanto, you should go with full mounts. A shirasaya, might be seen as too simple, not quite the word I want to use, but you get the idea. I know what it takes to make a good shirasaya and habaki, but some people might not care for it. I agree with Lin, make the standard styles, then you can make what you want after you get your stamp. There is nothing saying you can't make a knife with a japanese flair to it. As far as etched blades, I would not have a problem with a light clean etch for say one blade, the others should probably be traditional hand rubbed blades as they do like to see that you can do a good hand rubbed finish. Believe me I realize that you have to have a really good finish before you etch. I would be glad to answer any questions, just send me an e-mail or give me a call. Best of luck on your performance test.

Brion

Tate;

Blades that show hamon are just fine. At the journeyman level the work should be clean, straight, well finished,with good design. The applicant should also demonstrate their versatility. A well finished japanese style blade; sure. Traditional styled blades; a must.

A blade with heavy etching or oxides left on the blade does not demonstrate the best of either style of knives.

Good luck.

mike

I would like to thank you all for your suggestions. I plan on following the advise on this board as much as I am able to.

I had one further question on whether or not integrals are a no-no in test knives. Looking at examples of MS and JS knives, I didn't see any of them anywhere. Do the judges want to see guards on everything? I only ask since on other postings it was stated that the judges want to see the candidate is able to forge various styles of blade, ie only 2 of each style.

Tate;

A forged integral is fine. Guards or bolsters on your knives;it shows us another facet of your workmanship. We would not like to see slab handled knives for your test knives.

mike

Mike,

When you say "slab handles", are you referring to full tang knives and frame handled knives? The reason I ask is because I was considering making a traditionally styled spear point bowie with a frame handle for one of my presentation knives.

Thank you for all of your invaluable coaching!

Rick

Rick,

I dont mean to butt in, but...... I believe what Mike is talking about is for a test applicant to make something too simple. In other words a full tang blade with just scales only, no guard, nothing else. The scales pinned on the blade shows limited abilities and leaves more questions in the judges minds than answers, even though the knife is very clean. They want to see some range in your skills. That said, dont over extent yourself.

A frame handle would actually be a nice one to have in your test group. I'll be outside the judging rooms and would like to meet you and see your knives Rick. Lin

Thanks Lin! I appreciate your help and look forward to meeting you. It will have to be next year though.

On another note... I would like to pick your's or anyone else's brain on bowie guard dimensions and placement for balance.

I was showing a work in progress to a MS and he suggested that my oval guard should be centered based on the width of the blade as opposed to the width of the ricasso. Hope that makes sense. I can see his point in regards to contemporary bowies as quite a few are made that way (looks like the guard is hanging down with more guard below the handle than above when viewed from the side.) However, I am planning a more period piece with a coffin handle. Am I not correct to center the guard on the ricasso top to bottom. If this doesn't make sense I can find photo examples and post them.

Thanks again!

Rick

Rick,

If it is a period style knife, always stay true to the design as closely as is reasonable. I would position the guard the same as the original. On contemporary pieces, your going to have to use your judgement. One thing though. If the guard is supposed to be centered, make it centered. If you are positioning the guard to be asymetrical, make it look intentional, with no question about your control over the matter. This would be determined to a large degree on how much choil drop you would have. Design the knife on paper first, then follow your drawing. Lin

Thanks Lin! I feel better now about what I wanted to accomplish. The piece is going to be modeled after one that I saw in The Antique Bowie Knife Book so the guard will stay true to the original.

Again, I appreciate your input and guidance. Hopefully others are benefiting from these questions/answers as well.

Rick

You know I've been reading these threads about what is permissable, what is desireable, what is ....you fill in the blank, where ABS testing is concerned. Personally I belive the answer to all of these inquiries is quite simple: The judges want to see pieces that exemplify the highest skill level the applicant possesses at the time the pieces were made and presented for examination; nothing more, nothing less. I understand just how emotionally charged the preparation and testing process can be, Iv'e been there, but sometimes I believe we have a tendancy to overthink things a bit too much. If you are going for a JS, you should already know what good fit & finish values are. If you don't, you shouldn't be thinking about testing yet. The judges want to see perfect knives ideally. This means; NO flaws visible to the naked eye. If while making a piece you find yourself asking yourself,"Can I get by with that?" The answer must ALWAYS be a resounding "NO". operate with a "zero get by factor" and you will have nothing to worry about when the time for judging comes.

7 finish